Q: What was some of the early hits you had with the Gaylads?

A: It's all on the island (?), all on the island - 'Lady With The Red Dress', 'You Should Never Do That'. There's quite a bit of songs BB wrote. It's not really him write all the lyrics but it is work that we all collaborated and put together, but he (laughs), y'know, get all the claim. Not all he wrote, but most of them he wrote. But it's all a collaboration between him and myself, and even Maurice. Maurice (chuckles) wrote very little but he has done (some songs).

Q: He was part of it too.

A: Yeah, yeah. Everybody is putting their contribution, BB is like (laughs)... OK, he was like a bit ahead of us and he'd take a line from anywhere and...

Q: You mean he took a line or suggestion here and there from you or Maurice, and put that together, or some by-standers at the studio?

A: Not really us but like other artists that came to the studio and he used to what you'd call interviewing them.

Q: No, you mean 'audition'?

A: Yeah, audition (laughs)! I mean, he was like an assistant that work there, y'know what I mean (laughs)? But he was still a good writer in his own way. Most of the work he was more efficient, he could put the sentences together. You might have a line and then he would get it all together.

Q: Where was the Gaylads' rehearsal spot, where were you guys based at the time, mainly Trench Town?

A: No, no. It was in Vineyard Town and then we go to Rollington Town. It was basically in Rollington Town.

Q: But there was a lot of activity at the time in Joe Higgs' yard in Trench Town, and the Gaylads hung out there with the rest of the music community. You were there too?

A: Yeah, that's the Wailers.

Q: Yeah, the Wailers and a lot of other vocal groups, and Ken Boothe, Stranger Cole. I heard the Gaylads came there occasionally to rehearse?

A: I don't recall going there but I'm familiar with it, through I went to school in Denham Town, and Boys Town. Trench Town - I walked through there to get home, y'know. But other than that, Ken Boothe, they came out - we were on the east side and they were on the west side, the other side was on the west side that you mentioned, near to Boys Town. And then we form a band and that's one of the great (laughs) things that maybe BB was thinking that hey, let's go playing some instruments, so (laughs)... We actually got a band together, in that short space of time. We made a few recordings also. I can't even recall them (laughs) but we made a few recordings, with Slim Smith, on one of his early songs I think we backed him up once.

Q: So who played what in the band, you played bass, or?

A: No, Maurice was the bass player. BB play one of the guitars, I played one of the guitars.

Q: And on drums?

A: There was this guy named Shan, I forget what was his name but he was the drummer.

Q: Shand?

A: Shan, Shan... Winston something...?

Q: Winston Shand? Could it be him, because it was actually one Winston Shand who recorded for Harry Mudie (the brilliant 'Time Is The Master', this was a different character though, real name Winston Fallen aka 'Shan', a local friend on the street corner that BB taught to play drums at the time)? So he played drums, that's interesting.

A: He played in that group named Light of Sheba (probably referring to Cedric Brooks' embryonic afro/reggae/jazz fusion band The Light of Saba) back then, that was when I left the island so it should have been in the early seventies. But I remember that I know his name is Winston, but I can't remember the last name (laughs)!

Q: I know about one Winston Shand, could be that guy, perhaps.

A: But this guy Shan...? I don't think that Shan was his last name, 'Shan' was like a nickname, like just a name, y'know. I'm trying to recall his name, maybe Collins, Callender...?

Q: You mean Fil Callender (of In Crowd fame)?

A: No, Winston, Winston Callender (Fallen), he played in the band. We sung one of the songs that BB was... oh gosh! I forget. But we record quite a few artists, and we played on shows and all that. The band was doing well, y'know, cause it was...

Q: It's not that well-known that the vocal trio Gaylads was actually a self contained back-up band as well, is it (chuckles)?

A: Yeah, right. We did all that.

Q: But you were still called The Gaylads as an instrumental group, not switching to something else, an alias, when backing people up?

A: Yeah, yeah. As still the Gaylads, yeah.

Q: So you backed Slim Smith, anyone else you can recall?

A: Yeah, the guy Bumps, this guy they called him Bumps Oakley. Yeah, Bumps Oakley, he sang over one of the...

Q: He did something for Coxson like 'A Get A Lick', I think he ended up being a teacher later on.

A: Yeah, he sung quite a lot of mini hits on the island, was songs that we back up. And it was other artists but I just can't recall them. Yeah, within that period we made (laughs)... Jackie, Jackie always accompany us on the recordings, most of the time on the keyboard.

Q: Jackie who? Jackie Mittoo I assume?

A: Jackie Mittoo. He was always there, yeah.

Q: What is some of your most cherished memories of being in the Gaylads now?

A: Yeah, the thing is that I remember when Bob he came - Bob and the Wailers, they came to Coxson and we would all sing together, Bob would always be (laughs)... singin'. I mean as soon as he get up, 'cos (laughs) he got his guitar and he always goes - every so often we'd jam together, yeah, that's one of the (high) points.

Q: And that would mostly be at Brentford Road?

A: Yeah. And I mean it's a long time but I just don't recall much, and there's other things. But like I'm talking over the top, I can't think of it but that's the only thing that is about in my mind now.

Q: Then the Gaylads broke up for a while and BB left to play at hotels on the North Coast, what did you do then? He played out as 'Bibby & The Astronauts' while you and Maurice stayed in Kingston.

A: Oh, yeah, they went there. Well, I think that's the time I went to Mrs Pottinger and laid a few songs.

Q: What really happened, in your words, what was the reason for the break-up when you left the Gaylads - did Mrs Pottinger actually split the group, that has been said more than once, or what was the circumstances around this?

A: I can't recall what happened. But whatever it is they decided to go on and, y'know, I went another way. Then I remember one of my kids, my first son, maybe its domestic, I don't know, can't even recall but my son was born, maybe that's how it started. I started look at it with different view an' t'ing (laughs)! Something in that line, and like I didn't think it was going down good at that time.

Q: OK, so family matters came in-between, your son was born in that period like '67/68?

A: '67, yeah.

Q: When did you join the Hippy Boys, was this before or after when you started to do solo recordings for High Note?

A: Oh, you mean when...? Oh, wow, yeah (laughs)! We worked, you see Family Man and his brother, they were living in Rollington Town, so they always pass by when I'm going, through I'm living on the west side, from the east side it take about... And there they'd always be playing their drum and bass, drum and bass.

Q: In the backyard.

A: Yeah, in the yard. It wasn't the back, it was on the front of a house, the veranda. But then Lloyd too -Lloyd Charmers, that's how we formed that band, how it started. Lloyd Charmers is someone I knew from Vere Johns at the time, all back when I was going to school. You know, he is the one who put this band together. Just for the distance - it's not the distance, I'm trying to think back why didn't I go (laughs)! But I didn't keep up with the rehearsal too much, when I do go. I think Glen Adams was then in the band also. You know Glen Adams?

Q: Yes, he was later in The Upsetters. I believe many think of him as an organist in that band now, but he did quite a few vocal tracks in those days, from rock steady to the early reggae. Very good singer in his day, and still singin'.

A: Right, right. Then I didn't keep up with the band as the Upsetters and then Family Man went on, and his brother went on, to work with Bob from there. But we had some show was to do up by Braithville (?), that's where we were doing a show. It's just something with that I don't - I get disappointed, I don't make it coming (laughs)!

Q: Did you record with Hippy Boys? I know about a few things, like they did some stuff for Bunny Lee, Harry Robinson, were you a part of that?

A: Well, it was one recording I did with the Hippy Boys, with Slim Smith.

Q: Who did you record it for? Bunny?

A: He sang for Bunny Lee, he was in the group - what's the group name...? Slim Smith had a...

Q: The Uniques, perhaps?

A: Yeah, he was - that's it! So 'Watch This Sound', and the flipside to that recording. Actually I arrange all of that, so somebody (laughs) took the credit from me for arranging the music, the musical part of it, y'know what I mean. Yeah, that recording. And with the Gaylads 'Born To Love You', that's when the Gaylads band was backing that up too. The Slim Smith original 'Born To Love You', the reggae version, yeah.

Q: Yeah? That's a nice cut.

A: Yeah, I think we did some of our own songs too, if I can recall that. Maybe not.

Q: Do you recall working with the Hippy Boys for people like Harry Robinson, or Nehemiah Reid? And one guy called Bart San Fillipo? Small independent producers at the time.

A: No, I don't recall that. It's only like I went from Chris Blackwell in the early days, and we went to Coxson, then Pottinger. Then there was this guy, I don't remember the name of that place, but he's a Chinese guy.

Q: Could it be the late Leslie Kong?

A: No, not the one downtown, he was in Barbican this guy. Jackie Opel, when he was here he introduced me to this man.

Q: Ah! Justin Yap, the Top Deck label?

A: Top Deck, yes! Top Deck label, this was a long time (laughs)! I can't recall but Jackie Opel had introduced me to him, and get me to do the songs that I did record for him.

Q: So you've recorded for Top Deck as well. I thought BB was the only one from the group who worked with Yap.

A: Yeah, I think I did. I'm trying to remember if I did, I think I did four songs (at least Bibby & The Astronauts had records for Yap's Top Deck imprint, like 'No More Will I Wonder', 'Sweet Dreams' and 'Dear Beverley'). But I never hear anything about that (laughs)! I don't recall that, I can't even remember the name or whatever, recording the songs.

Q: Was there a lot of animosity between you, Maurice and BB, I mean when you decided to go solo?

A: I'm trying to remember exactly what... BB them, I think they was on the North Coast, I'm not sure, but they make a recording and it make a hit and then someone - I think we went back together, in the group, we did record for Mrs Pottinger. So I'm not sure, I'm not quite remembering how this went but then we recorded together for Mrs Pottinger as the Gaylads. Maybe somewhere around there, that's when the split comes about, through as I say money can (laughs) break a lot of things, things like that happen. That's what I think caused the split.

Q: Did you work with anything else to support the family at this time?

A: No, it was strictly (laughs) recording. Yeah, it was recordings I dealt with, mainly as depending on bread on the table so much.