Q: OK. But we're not exactly talking a jealous music scene then, in bigger terms? Good to hear, if that's the case. It served a good purpose regardless who went, for the local scene anyhow.

A: Like I say, this was producers there, right. One man was there, Buster was there, producing his music. Him have a music where he is producing himself, and Byron Lee had my music so that planted a corn. So I don't know if there's some jealousy a gwaan between dem two man deh, but I was being caught up, I was in the midst a dem. I never really have much to say. Because whe dem was talkin' about the records, with the recording is like dem a come fe promote we music, and this man have his music fe promote. Is like the producer dem keep that part. You know, like it's a secret t'ing whe dem have with dem company. Like those t'ings, if what them did plan fe really do in that time fe really go there and promote Jamaican music, make them show that, y'know what I mean, then the music would a break out. But like I'm saying, some jealousy... I don't know if there is some jealousy a gwaan between them. Them come fe promote one music, and there's more than one music come there and was playing.

Q: Apart from Byron on bass, who else was in the Dragonaries line-up on that trip?

A: Byron was the bassman, and saxophone-man was a lickle short man... I remember the saxophone man very good, yunno, beca' he used to play fe Duke Reid. And then you have Frank Anderson, trumpeter. And then you have - I don't know if you ever hear about Arty Williams? Two of them that play (inaudible). Then guitarist now, you have Ken - Ken Lazarus. Let me see there now... no, we had the bredda called Arty Williams, keyboard player. And then you have a next... they have two trombone players there... I can't recall them names so clearly right now, but them have some very good musicians. Yeah man, some of the best, his band was very good. Very good for the party-type, like, clubs and all that. 'Cause at that time you used to have the Blues Busters and me, sometimes Jimmy Cliff would be around too. Jimmy Cliff would come and, y'know, Toots, the Maytals and all them guys. You have all them guys for a show, there used to be plenty.

Q: Looking back on the purpose for that trip, you feel it was a success?

A: Well, I feel at the time, that is just a first door a open and when that's provided you're hoping as a singer that you really go through the World's Fair and to decide to get them fe penetrate this kind of music. But I'm not telling you that I was really satisfied to how the whole t'ing worked out, y'know what I mean. Beca' you have other people that goes around and say those t'ings they feel, think they say and don't know what went on there.

Q: How you mean?

A: Because people wasn't paying attention to what was going on, and you have people who wasn't sure what's going on or do this and that. Like I say, what I'm feeling about it is that the Father open a door for me, y'know what I mean. This was a chance you get fe really go out there and prove and show the world with this music that Jamaica have something of its own, and produce it and bring it on their shores, y'know what I mean. But you have people who kill plant before it grow, kill plant before it start strive. It's like what I'm saying, if you give the music a chance and see what becomes of it, instead of exploiting before them see what's gonna come on, then them would see what become of the music. People go there and exploit it, plug it before they start come out. That's why it turned out in something it wasn't supposed to be.

Q: You don't sound very pleased with the whole event.

A: No. Up to now, you see, number one: when you come back here, yunno, man start fe being in another man's place and seh, well, that is the man who start the t'ing, and that is the man who know how Jamaican music go, and this is the only man can play Jamaican music, right. This band is not a ska band, this man is a man whe play music fe (inaudible) and put them inside the band fe play the ska music, right. This man is a soca man a play, right, this man. This man is don't like born to be in ska band and was never taught fe be in a ska band. Those were some kinda remarks that some man thought - this man play soca music, this man ya play soca music and this man a play ska. So all dem t'ing deh would come in like a contest. So, I'm saying that I'm very glad that the music went to this World's Fair and we went there to promote it, and the reaction, the outcome of it, we're pleased with the kind of connection an' t'ing. Ca' them never make it even known of what was happening, see. I went there and the artists promote it, but I had heard before that other people was there promoting their music instead of mine, then I would have used other t'ings to say. But like I'm saying, if a man is a soca man or man is a ska man deh, you would have a complete show to travel on. But I've heard this about not picking them (Skatalites) because of Rasta, y'know, from if you look a way or dress a way, the type of music deh, y'know what I mean. But the music don't have nutten to deal with if you is a Rastafari man or if you a dreadlocks man or... from you playing the music you're playing the music. The music is the music, right, and the man would play the music right without his Wareika muse (Rasta chanting down 'duppy' business, ghosts) or what him defending. It don't have anything fe deal with the music itself, because from the music play and it play the right way and people love it - and its got music, I mean, the religion don't have nothing fe deal with it, it don't have no... it no exploit it, no way. I mean, whether a man is a Rastaman but really and truly, them certain man from certain band them have a lotta remarks for... no matter if it's a ganja band or a Rastaman band or whatever. I mean, them t'ing deh would really a gwaan because it's any man's freedom fe really put out what him really want from inside a himself. A lot of t'ings really get mix-up, really connect with that and music, y'know. Beca' you have other bands whe play, right, and these musicians - I'm calling them names to you, who was the original musicians from that time, right. Man such as Lloyd Brevett, Lloyd Knibbs, Jah Jerry, Roland Alphonso, Johnnie Moore, Tommy McCook, Don Drummonds, you see, these men now is men who are ska man, who is really ska man dem, yunno, Skatalites. But notwithstanding, I'm not seeing that them is the founder of ska music. The real founder of ska music is Drumbago. Yeah - Drumbago, Jah Jerry, and a man you call Blues, which way you'd have Lloyd Brevett play with him, play as a ska man too. But is man like Blues and Lloyd Brevett, and the man on piano now you woulda have 'Easy Snappinī' - him is the one who's name is Theophilius Beckford, then you have Roland and Tommy McCook. Them man deh as I say back the whole a the Jamaican ska music, them man deh was there from the start.

Q: I don't have much in terms of information on this one, if it ever existed, but do you have any memories of an album you did for King Edwards in the mid sixties? This was supposedly out on the Black Swan label in England.

A: Ohh, an album? That is like a CD?

Q: No, no - this was out in the sixties, if it ever was. But you don't have any memory if this ever came out?

A: No. But I did some songs for Vincent (King) Edwards, yunno, tune like 'Ungodly People'.

Q: And 'River Come Down'.

A: 'River Come Down'. Yeah.

Q: 'Seek and You Will Find', 'Home Sweet Home'.

A: Yeah. And 'Old King Cole'. I did a couple songs for Vincent Edwards an' t'ing like that, but those songs now came out on a different label. I think I saw songs on a next album with Chris too. I think it's Chris Blackwell press and record. But it was all with other artists too, yunno, but I never see my name come out on that album. And I was thinkin' if Chris Blackwell had anyt'ing to deal with any music for me, seeing when he had that compilation with all the artists with all the long-time tunes dem from that era, and upon seeing it I was wondering, yunno. But maybe Chris Blackwell and King Edwards had some kind of connection there. But I have never seen that, I don't know if you ever get to see a label called Blue Beat?

Q: Right, the UK label?

A: Oh yes, that was the Blue Beat label now whe I had some songs in them early times now, through it's like 'Pack Up Your Troubles' and some other songs that I did from way down in the sixties. But I think it was a man by the name of (Emile) Shallit, he was like a man from Europe there, London, who do the Blue Beat label. I lose contact with him, through I was keepin' in contact with him for a longer while before. That company a Blue Beat had different, different songs that came out, because I think Wilfred (Edwards) alone was singin' on that label. I think Derrick was singin' on that label too, Millie Small came out on that label. A lot of artists came out, but I don't know if that company was still in action there - maybe they're still there, but maybe under a different name.

Q: I think Mr Shallit passed away.

A: Ohh, probably, 'cause it's a long while. Well, I don't know if you ever hear about this record (label), the people call it Trojan Records?

Q: Yes.

A: Oh yeah, they have a company them call Trojan and whatever else this company's name (Sanctuary), but those are the people who I am fightin' a lawsuit from my rights towards some songs they have been using, and I haven't got any response for it but it's supposed to come to some kinda agreement with this music. So I'm still here and I'm trying to see if my lawyer can work on it for me so I can get a good response. 'Cause you know artists who have done music in the past an' t'ing like that, is that contracts that haven't been signed or contracts or people who used people proved without consent. You know, you're supposed to get a lawyer or somebody who can seek about the music for them other places in the world. So I have a lawyer there to try and see if he can seek about my rights for me.

Q: Hope it bears fruit for you.

A: I would love it to be, man, because it's been a while since I have been on the music scene and I need to have some new product out there now. People been asking me why I haven't some new produc', y'know. And it's because of lack of communications, with all of that now. Because it's not like one of the days when you could find a good company. Somebody who decide, like, I mean you do some work and get some pay and they give you a contract and you work with them for a while, whatever, and then you could have a good contract in order to make some good music.

Q: At the moment I haven't seen the majority of your work from the sixties, but I know you have a vast amount of releases on 7" single for various producers. Is there enough - from what you remember - to put together a full album release of the work for King Edwards, Buster, Pottinger or Duke Reid for example? If you could estimate, roughly, if there's enough for an album for each one of those? I mean, I have no problem with a compilation through different producers - that's also needed - but for each one of those, if you could estimate, is there one or several albums in the can there?

A: I was lookin' at those tracks that I do on Buster's label, yunno, Buster have a good amount of songs that I did for him. I have about twenty-seven - I can say about twenty songs, about twenty-seven songs I can see there now from Buster that could be a good album, if I wanted to, from in that era. Then we have other producers like Duke Reid, I think Reid, if he had chosen, could've put out a good album for me, if he decided to compile some songs together. 'Cause up to now I do have songs that I don't think they have released yet, they still have some songs there for me.

Q: Your impressions of Duke Reid, Monty? You have any 'fond' memories of this legendary man in Jamaican show business? It's not all bad, like what you often hear about him. I wish there could be more than 'robber' and 'rip-off bwoy' sometimes.

A: Oh, well, I wouldn't say I would think of him as a producer or a promoter. Him shouldn't be seen as a producer - first thing, I'd really say. Go ahead and be a liqour store man or whatever, y'know what I mean, but in my opinion fe dealing with artists, I can't give you his appearance with that. Because that man he was a constable, he was an inspector, right, and the way how I see him treats artists, him and some more, is like I mean that kinda 'ism' they cyaan deal with people under that kinda ism. 'Cause one a the time is like 'look brother, if you have a t'ing the same t'ing wha' I tell you say look, if you have a t'ing fe me, is just me alone you haffe sing for', right. 'You cyaan sing for no other company, yes?' So how comes you want me to sing for your company and you cyaan provide my need of pay, pay whatever I want fe keep me going? And then it would cause me arguments. It would cause a man fe think seh, well, then a man will send a man to come look for you. Them aks you 'look now, you sing fe this man alone' - it might cause a conflict, a war or whatever. You see, them can only seh that to one artis', certain set a artist now is like 'look, you cyaan pay me for my work, me cyaan sing fe you alone', right.

Q: As if you could survive by singin' for Treasure Isle only.

A: Oh yeah, oh yeah. One a the time is like I was trying to hitting the market kinda... not big, yunno, but I was like, everybody knows that I make some good records an' t'ing, and I was in King Edwards' stable - that was the sound system days. I deh so long and I have Buster around, I put Buster in a position that mek everybody say 'rey Buster!' And then again, I cyaan see no good response. I haffe leave from deh so an' go, then him have the record and give to this man. I haffe go out to Edwards and just a go on try fe a live! This man don't like that! Lickle more you go and what you've got fe your record is not even enough that you can eat an' drink an' look like you're living. And if you should a go to a promoter an' seh: 'Man look, if this is what's the business, yunno, I don't see it'. Now on trackside I don't see no financial business going on. What's going on? Like you asking you would like to know if your record has been sold. 'Here and there'. Is not a good answer! You going get some kinda, like, you don't go too deeply fe know wha' gwaan about your own affair, and if your mind don't sharp then you're the type of person who don't know to walk away from some deep t'ing that the law might get involved with - you and that man get involved, and those are the t'ings that turn the artist away. Him might waan find out what going on with him t'ings and because him think seh, well, then this man is a type of person, him don't go to this man. And you have some kinda producer that use them strategy on the artists.

Q: Right. OK, that was Duke Reid, but what about your work for the late Leslie Kong? The Beverley's stuff is mostly excellent and much overlooked as I see it.

A: Leslie is like all of the other producers, beca' him search a lot of good artists. Derrick was there, Derrick Morgan was there with him and him haffe search fe good artists and all that (chuckles). Like I'm saying, in the business with them now as a producer and you as the artist fe... you're lookin' to get fe more work. Ca' a man might know you as a good painter or you is a good welder or whatever work you do, you would a quickly use that man and would a show pon a t'ing an' seh 'we have a session', right. But him would ask each man there, if you woulda have somebody there whe him know seh, well, then whether if you're a hit-man or make a good tune or not, y'know, him don't treat you the kinda way how you want to be treated. So if him seh that well then, look man I do 'Sampson' for you' and you say 'man, you haffe give me pound fe this tune ya', or whatever, and you just come up. It don't cause a man fe really seh, well, then bwoy right now beca' you sing a tune for him an' leave an' go to a next producer, him may have a feeling through that, right. And Leslie Kong, him was a guy that seh, well look now, he was a next one a dem whe you 'stay', stay fe him stable all the while and him not paying you the amount of money whe you desire, y'know. Is another whe pick up one of dem the other lickle artists dem now and seh, well, then 'stay a fe me stable' and na give them nutten. And you as the artist go to him and seh, well, then 'this is what I charge fe a song', like him no waan pay fe it, yunno. Them guys deh inna the music business, I figure seh at the end of the day them going still pay. Ca' you see most of the time you hear them woulda come ask you 'wha' you have for me now?', or 'wha' gwaan', y'know. And if you no sound good, if you not a hit-man and mek the record an' it a sell, a man don't feel like him waan pay you.

Q: What about Nehemiah Reid? You did 'Words of Wisdom', 'Suffer In The Gutter' and 'Words of My Mouth' for this guy.

A: Nehemiah? I think a Aston, a Aston him name, man.

Q: Yeah?

A: Aston Reid is the same, same lickle t'ing like Duke Reid. Beca' when you hear I first record 'Humpty Dumpty' in those days, 'Humpty Dumpty' is Prince Buster and 'Money Can't Buy Life'. So, in those days was sound days, so when Buster would carry all that tune and aim it to Duke and him set, you see, and that tune would cause a whole disaster, whe I say uproar there where the music's concerned, or supp'm. Duke Reid would a really call want me have me on a session, and me go to that studio with him, was a lotta times, man. I have been down at that studio with him in them times and I'm not telling you seh, well, then is I have to go through the whole session fe deal with him. Ca' that man is a man whe you have to go up to him all the while, yunno. 'Hey!', an' t'ing like that. And I wouldn't say him draw him rifle, but you have to be careful how you really get around him.

Q: In what way?

A: Well, like I can tell you personally, I can remember a time - like I tell you - when I sing fe him, any producer, yunno, I can remember one a the time, him have a lickle short guy who is workin' down there, him call him 'Phantomino'. Yeah, a lickle short guy. And I can get some good understanding that he had that guy work, servin' the place, lookin' for me, yunno. And I hear him send this man come look for me, if him try fe hurt me or kinda do me somet'ing, 'cause he work for the Duke, and I don't sign no contract with this man.

Q: Duke.

A: Yeah! I just sing 'pon a basic t'ing fe him. I don't know how much me record a sell, I don't know which part, this record go all 'bout inna the world and all that. But I never fear him. You know, I never fear wha' him a gwaan with or whatever him a gwaan with. Beca' that was my (inaudible) amongst them man deh, whatever them a come up and a gwaan with. Certain time I think I walk them out, I walk it out and seh, well, them fe leave me alone. But I hear all them t'ings deh pass through me and I never really could tell you seh, well, bwoy a man really sent, come lookin' for me (chuckles). But I see them man deh 'round and 'round and look 'pon me a kinda way and I see it from one studio to the other, you know. And I go amongst him and I think I went back to him and say what is the problem, 'what was wrong?' Bwoy, I would a say, each one teaches one. Yeah.

Q: It's being said you didn't follow-up all the success in the ska era when the music changed to rock steady, that you were considered 'old hat' by the early reggae era. But you had a couple of successful records in that time like 'Put On Your Best Dress', 'Say I'm Back, 'Last Laugh' - you recall those?

A: Oh... I saw that tune playing on the internet. I don't know if you ever hear about Clive Tennor?

Q: Yeah, that should be Clive Murphy of the Tennors.

A: Yeah, he is the one that sing 'Ride Yu Donkey'. Yeah, I sang a couple songs for him, and he have that tune on the internet, he call it 'Tell Them I'm Back'.

Q: 'Say I'm Back', yes.

A: 'Say I'm Back', OK. Then again you have a tune named 'Last Laugh'. I did that tune for Desmond Dekker, it's just a guy who don't want to see me - like you say - I didn't follow-up on the scene, yunno. Those were the times when I would say a kinda treatment that you get from the promoters what was happening on the scene, to the music, and you found that music was being sent overseas and all that. And a little wha' you would a call it... I wouldn't follow-up because there is a certain set of artist - like I say I hear a man with him own mouth, I hear a man with them own mouth seh is ska music is Jamaica own music, is like them no like it whe I tell them no like it. Is like your own t'ing and you see no great flavour in it, or them flavour dem no like it. Yea, and I hear man talk with them own mouth, and that is somet'ing with me - I can have my own t'ing I create, right, when it's mine until I don't like it, y'know. I think I hold my corner is the t'ings whe if seh you a man to say: 'Monty, him would not be around at certain times'. Yes! Certain times, but it kinda grieve me whe how the man deh treat the music, right. Is somet'ing whe you and me sit down and create, right, from Drum Street we sit down and we mek it. And you a go around and you a exploit an' gwaan like seh, well, then me no like t'ings, me no like it. Like you a prefer tek a next man music an' a next man t'ing and deal with it. But the t'ings whe you mek fe your own self regardless how you like it, but them man do dem whole heap a t'ing. So, if you hear somebody a seh, well, yes I would even admit to the fact I was away from the scene for a while, just for things like that.

Q: How did you respond to the change to rock steady?

A: Yes, I loved it. I love rock steady and, y'know, like I'm saying as a man whe I'm not telling you seh, well, I'm versatile. I like all kinda music but then again I'm telling you seh rock steady, rock steady music is a man come inside a Jamaica. A man come inside a Jamaica and a try to change Jamaica music from wha' it was, yunno. Still I love it because it's a different style a t'ing that gives a different flavour. Slowing down the riddim, right, and mek it more lighter. I don't know if you ever hear about the man Lynn Taitt?

Q: Oh yes, guitarist extrordinarie.

A: Yeah, he's a guy from Trinidad. He came here over Jamaica and when I was down at Duke Reid, he was down there at Duke Reid and then go to Leslie Kong and he go all around and play and play. And he is the one whe really try fe change this music and get it all slower, and play it with a more slower pluggin', pluggy beat, y'know what I mean. You see them a play the tune 'pon mostly minors now, from major chords. Them add more minor to it, like mek it with just two chords, instead of them mek it with three-four. I tell you the musical inspiration we have - them na play the tune with all four-five major chords, them play it all with two minor from one minor to the other (imitates the beat). And it a gwaan fe all half of the tunes, right through the tune dem way deh, and they call it rock steady and slow it down. So, is like I say, me change and versatile, but me na go tell you seh me a go leggo and me hate the t'ing ya, 'cause is my own. A new t'ing might come and a different beat, but me na go tell you say, me no love my t'ing wha' me a do - me love my ska music, me love the ska music and me change and do lickle dancehall style music, right. But like I'm saying, you haffe be creative, you have to have your own style. If you born Jamaican whe you have your Jamaican beat, it's your international beat.

Q: Where did you get that 'Monty' nickname from by the way?

A: Oh, that was my... wha' you call it now... my pet-name, yunno, and I just use it as a singin' name beca' is not really 'Monty' I named, is Lloyd. Is my middle-name, them just call me Monty as my pet-name. My mother call me that, so I used that as my singin' name.

Q: So how come you left the island in 1970, you settled in the States then, right, not Canada as I've seen somewhere?

A: Yeah, 1970 - you mean when I come to the States, right? That was a sponsored trip. I was in DC.

Q: OK. Speaking about some later tunes you did, you did at least one tune in the mid seventies, perhaps earlier, titled 'Hard Time In Babylon' (for Pama) - you remember that one?

A: 'Hard Time In Babylon'? Yeah, that wasn't done in the States, it was done in Jamaica, yunno, and I did an album in the States.

Q: When was this?

A: Sometime in the nineties, I think 1990. 'Cause that album deh, that was my first I do over here (done with one Michael Enkrumah).

Q: What have you've been doing otherwise in the States all these years?

A: I was in Washington since I come here. Bwoy, I do apart from them lickle singin' music I haffe work, yunno. I work some stuff like hotel an' all them t'ing deh, them stuff deh.

Q: What about this story that Max Romeo 'discovered' you in New York and took you down to do some of your first shows in ages at Heineken Startime in Jamaica?

A: Oh, that was what Max Romeo told them that he was the one who discovered me here and then brought me back from Washington, and from Washington to Jamaica. But that wasn't me and him, it was him and my son. He was talkin' some about Max Romeo. But it was Keith Brown, man, Keith Brown (one of the main men behind promoting the Startime concert) was the one who contacted my son and brought me back in Jamaica. And I do Heineken Startime, was good experience.

What we need now is at least a double-CD package of Eric 'Monty' Morris and not a release limited to a single album such as the hard to find 'Those Youthful Years' that former Tennors singer/producer Clive Murphy released some time back. It looks more like it was unofficial than a legit release, hopefully it will do Mr Morris some good though. There is shamefully little of his catalog available these days, I wonder who will be the first to realise a project such as compiling the best of what the man did in his heyday for us to enjoy in this time? Long overdue and well deserved is just the beginning of describing it. C'mon, someone with the right connections, seriously, involve the man on a project like this and do us all a favour in the long run by releasing this timeless music to the public once more, and make sure the man get his fair share of everything. That's what I would call 'a treat'. Yes mon.

7" single information courtesy Roots Knotty Roots.