Q: Then you put out 'Life' on the Exclusive label. A: What was it called? Q: 'Life'. A: OK, 'Life'. I don't even know how it go, beca' I voiced that song but I don't even remember how that song went, trust me. I don't even remember I did that song. I know the melody of the song (sings): 'Life oh life for a boy out a street deh...'. But it was dealing with the system alone, that song. Q: You formed your own labels, such as King Town from early on for your own stuff, and also produced other artists, like 'Jah Lion' by Ken Quatty on the Dub Station label. You mentioned him before, tell me some more about this deejay Ken Quatty. A: Yeah well, Ken Quatty was a friend, just a friend. First I and him we start to sing along with a guy called Dion, we called him Lester. And we start together, the three of us. But every time I call Ken Quatty to really do like try sing the harmony for a song, he always says he's asleep - his older brother tell us that he's sleeping, so every time I go to his yard to pick him up to go to rehearsal, he's always sleeping. So I just say forget it, y'know. And then Dion now, he was a guy who is always trying but he can't sing. So it's like, I really bought a guitar together, and I just say "OK, if you wanna sell me the guitar, sell me your share of the guitar". And they say they don't wanna sing no more, but they can't sing anyway. I pay for the guitar and I now own the guitar, so that is how I reach over by Washington Gardens and start the group The Somarcands along with Nicky Thomas, the guy who did 'Love Of The Common People'. Because I was owner of a guitar, it's like you own a master instrument, you understand. And everybody looking at you walking with the guitar, you're a singer because of... you know? It was a lot of fun. Anyway now, Ken Quatty was out of the group, Dion was out of the group, right, and I and Hugh Lewis and Eggar Miller and this guy Nicky Thomas, we start the group called The Somarcands, that was how we formed the group. When I start producing back now, that's how I go for Ken Quatty back and I say "OK, you can't sing but you mus' fe talk, you mus' a fe talk a song". So I set up the melody for 'Jah Lion', yunno, I do the intro and he do the rest of 'Jah Lion'. He even do a song called 'Row Fisherman Row' and that song was very big in Holland, I got a lot of money for that song, got a big money for that song from the Khouris. But the Khouri people along with Total Sounds was the best people in the recording business.

Q: Still what I heard about Total Sounds according to Ras Karbi, this guy McDonald emptied the account and vanished from the island, just left his staff and company stranded right there. A: Yeah, yeah. OK, I don't know. Q: Just disappeared, possibly left back for Australia again. A: But man, the man was a good man. I don't know, I don't know... it might be. Q: But you own the rights to your Total Sounds output still? A: All of the rights, all of the songs I own the rights. I never give him no rights for nutten, he only own the distribution, distribute all over the world or whatever he want to distribute. Not all over the world, but if he can export, they export. But that's it, they never get the rights for it. Like, if someone call them from London and say they want a hundred copies, and they send out a shipment, they can sell on a export deal, because that's how they mostly sell from Jamaica, on export. Q: Then you had the Top Of The Pop label around this time. A: Yeah, I got the Top Of The Pop label, you got it. A song called 'Dinner In Bed' and a few more songs. Q: Plus one called 'Chase Them'. A: 'Chase Them', yeah.

Q: And when David Jahson hit with 'Natty Chase The Barber' on the 'Ali Baba' riddim, you did 'Barberman Bawling'. A: No, well, 'Barberman Bawling' was a... Q: That 'Barberman' stuff was a popular theme in the music at this time, a spin-off from the Jahson tune I suppose? A: What happened with 'Barberman Bawling': in those days all the young guys they wanna be Rasta, and then some guys say them a dread, some say they are Nyah, some say they are... but they're still Rasta. And there was a lot of locksing going on, and then the barbershop was empty, so I say man, it's time to sing a song like (chuckles): 'Barberman bawling, the youth them a starving...'. And that song, I done a tone of voice, a sound close like a Ken Boothe, but I sing it... I know the melody in that song, like I changed it. The other day my friend who is my publisher, he heard that song and he said, "Hey, you tried to sing like Ken Boothe!" And I said, "No, the sound just come up and a just find the melody for it". It's just that, I just do it. But it sound like Ken Boothe, yeah. I even do a song called 'We Live Together' that was very big in England, Joy White and Jerry Baxter. Ahhh... Q: 'Always Together', the Bob & Marcia song. A: The Bob Andy song, it was very big. It sell a lot in England. It sell and sell, y'know. That song was big. David Rodigan, man, Rodigan used to murder that song, man. Q: Are you aware of the inclusion of this song on Lloyd Coxsone's '12 The Hard Way' anthology? It's out since the late eighties on the Tribesman label in the UK, the same 'Always Together'. A: I know nothing about that. Q: Also, on that album there is the Well Pleased & Satisfied track 'Open The Gate Bobby Bowa', but with your name, as a solo cut. A: Yes? On that album? Q: Yes, '12 The Hard Way'. A: That guy have to give me some money, man! It seems like we're in for a big thing, because you have the proof for the album. All you have to give me the proof, and I will get the lawyers to deal with it, he gotta pay me some money. Q: OK. A: When you are in business, once you get the proof, you are in business, y'know. Beca' I don't give him my songs. I've got so much things on my mind, man. If you hadn't got the history of mine, I could never reach so far with those things. Thank you for what you've done, man. Q: Cool. A: I tell you this, you understand, ca' you take me back so far and so deep. When I was doing the part with 'Living In The Slum', it breaks me down because I started crying. It's like I feel the things that happened in those days, and it made me weak. That's why Hank Holmes he said, man, I'm deep, y'know. There's no group in Jamaica weh sound like Well Pleased & Satisfied. Q: I believe this album has the most readily available tracks by Well Pleased & Satisfied up to now, it has remained in print over the years. You have Delroy Wilson, Jimmy Lindsay, Faybiene Miranda, Ras Midas and Burning Spear on it, among others. A: I know nutten about that, man. Nothing, no statement. Nutten, man! See, I've been robbed ever since I came in the business that I'm so lucky in the business that... when I say lucky, I've had success. My kids always wanna dance offa my songs. Once I hear a sound, I never stop add to it. I remember King Jammys offered me a Jack Ruby riddim. Mrs Pottinger always wanted me to come and work. Lee Perry, when he heard my song 'Chat Chat', he said wow, ca' I made a song like Bob Marley, and he said he want me to come and do some recording for him. So I say yeah, although I don't reach his studio yet. It's like I'm nervous. I don't see how I'm gonna collect from none of these guys, y'know. These guys they make money, they don't pay money. But I'm trying to hold on to what I've got. Q: How much of the original tapes has survived? A: I've got all of them, all of my original tapes, all of my original recordings. I even got all of my original recordings with me right now on CD, and also DAT cassette. So if I come London... if anyone is interested - I would want to have a company, or a company with me anywhere I go, who would have the contract I could sign with. But this album 'Reggae In The Bag', I would like a big company to have this album. I think it's gonna be big, this new album. It has recordings soundin' like Channel One, some of the recordings sound like Channel One. It got some R&B mixed with reggae, and it's a fusion of a lot of different music. But it's reggae, and it's just solid, like original music. Original instruments, everything sounds real, y'know. It's a good album, the best I've ever really done so far. Q: Can you recall a tune named 'Warrior' on the Top Of The Pops label? A: 'Warrior', OK. 'Warrior', 'Warrior'... 'This warrior from Port Maria...'. OK, yeah. And 'Dinner In Bed'. I did a song called 'Wanna Be Loved'. And there's another song again, 'General'. It's speaking about royal people - it's based on people who come off a war, they would send the parents to war. You had to be a man of bold. They would either take your soul or you would go to war, and burn you cheap. You got to honor your respect, you couldn't sit on the throne and wait for someone else to go out there and defend your country for you and you stayed there and... you know? Sometime it worked, but most of the kings though had to go out there. So what the 'General' is saying is that the general is coming up to my father's funeral and gave his twenty-one gun salute and say he was a brave youth. But me and my mother we got fatherless, lost our father. Like the one father we have was taken away for the war. And when he die they gave him a twenty-one gun salute. The leaders of the world are purely war, y'know. That was like the African world policy, y'know, the war general. Q: So after Total Sounds you went to Sonia Pottinger? A: I leave Sonia Pottinger and go to Total Sounds for distribution. Beca' what happened is that I gave her the song called 'News Carrier', I told her that though where she got all the contacts at the radio station, ca' she got the big contacts at the no. 1 radio station, that would give me x amount of play for the song. Ca' I want the song to really go big. I wanna make an album for myself. So I told her that look, this song is my song, but you still gonna pay x amount. When you paid me x amount, cut it in half, take so much of money back. When she done that, she told me that, "Jerry, look, this song is going, man. This song is large now, wow!" "Wha'! It's really selling". And when I go for my royalty statement, Mrs Pottinger don't wanna pay. So I go back to King Tubbys and book some time. I would give you a history of King Tubbys. So, I go to King Tubbys and I book some time, and I do the song 'News Carrier' on the same riddim. So that is how because I was hurt, so I say I'm gonna use the same melody on the same riddim and do a different song called 'News Carrier'. So I take that song to Total Sounds because they were distributing for me at the same time. So that is how, you understan'. Mr Mac he treat me very good, because he give me a good money at the time.

Q: OK, 'News Carrier' was released on Truth & Rights as well as Total Sounds. What was the first record you cut for Mrs Pottinger at High Note, this was 'Sweetie Come From America'? A: 'Sweetie Come From America', yes. And with that one as I told you before she only gave me fifty thousand dollars for the soundtrack, that's the only money. I didn't received no royalty. Q: That tune was released in the seventies, then reused in 1986 for the movie starring Jimmy Cliff, Peter O' Toole and whoever it was, not a very interesting movie I have to say. But anyhow, what a surprise for you to be included in a Hollywood soundtrack. A: Yeah, yeah. I was surprised. But at the same time just because I got so much robbed, I was saying I need some money I'm gonna hold out. But my friend Hugh Lewis was what we called jumpy - he was hasty. So he signed up, because Mrs Pottinger was tellin' us that look, we need to go right now. So either it's now or never. Q: Pity, because it turned out to be yet another rip-off, sort of anyway. A: Yeah, a rip-off anyway. So you see, anyone I've worked for in the music business, I always get robbed. I never get... the only people that ever made me feel good in the record business is the Khouri people, Richard Khouri and Paul Khouri. All of the Khouri family by Federal, that's the company Bob Marley buy out now and turned into Tuff Gong. And Mr Mac from Total Sounds recording company, he was the guy that made me feel good too. But otherwise, all these labels and the this and the that, Mrs Pottinger and the High Note label and the... nutten, man. Q: You did 'Walla Walla' for Mrs Pottinger too. A: Yeah, OK! Yeah, I didn't remember that song, man. I'm saying you was in Jamaica (laughs)! Yeah, I did 'Walla Walla' for her plus I get a little money... no! I didn't do 'Walla Walla' for her, I think maybe she distribute that. Q: Right, it came upon her High Note label anyhow. A: I think she distribute that for me. But she want me to do an album, but the way she treat me with the 45s, want her to own and produce, I said no. If you gonna treat me this way on my own product, I ain't gonna get nutten for an album, so I just walk out and leave her. I don't go back to her. Sometime I pass her and say hi, what's up. But I realised you can't... you know? They are something, man. They don't think of the artists, all of them is the same. I've heard Dennis Brown say something that Joe Gibbs with his production is treating him the best, and I appreciate that, y'know.

Q: One of your hardest songs must undoubtedly be 'Pickney A Have Pickney' on High Note, even the title stands out. Tell me more about this track. A: Yeah, that track now... I don't even know. It's like, I ask her and she don't even know where the tapes are or nutten. Because she's like she could make a lot of money now but I don't know if she don't know what to do or if she's interested or not. But she could make a lot of money, because she buys out Treasure Isle, all of Treasure Isle catalog. And along with High Note she have a lot of business there going on. So all she need to do is set up a business and start distribute worldwide and make some money. But I don't know how to come together, although I have to really get those songs. Because 'Pickney A Have Pickney', I need to do over that song, 'Sweetie Come From America', I'm gonna do over back that song, and I'm gonna try... But I need some original instruments, like original drums, original bass, you understand. So I don't know when I come back to Jamaica if I'm gonna get Ranchie and Sly Dunbar to do it, or what I'm gonna do over back of them songs. Q: The inspiration for that track now. A: Well, when I look around and see... every time children leave school like eighteen, and the first thing I see is their stomach swell, and you see a little guy and they say he is the baby's daddy, and you see it's not workin', he don't have a trade, and you say wha', what is this? Why should children have children? Q: Still kids. A: They are just a kid, y'know. And they can't take care of their kid, why should they have children? And they have to carry it to the country and leave it on their grandmother. That is what the song was saying, y'know. And children should not have children, pickney should not have pickney. (Chuckles) It's not hard to wash the baby's napkin, but if you can't wash that, so why should you have kids when you can't do it. (Chuckles) Yeah, that's 'Pickney A Have Pickney'. But all of the songs you hear I talk about, I wrote all of the songs, man. I have a song now that I do... Bob Marley do a song called 'Slave Driver', so I'm gonna add some words to that song, just spice it up a little. You know, just some lickle simple things. I'm not gonna use all of his words, so when I've voiced it, maybe I will put it on the album 'Reggae In The Bag', I'm not sure. I want the album to get straight to my... I want all the rights to come to me, my family. Q: Not sure if I got you correctly regarding the songs you had for Sonia Pottinger, you still have them or she have them in her possession? A: No, she have all the tapes. Q: I heard something she was ill, but not sure about that though, if she still is. So out of business, perhaps. A: I heard from her... son or if it was her daughter or something that she was living in the States, that she's married to a pilot or some guy like that, I don't know. I'm not sure. Q: But what about those solo tracks you did on the Ball of Fire label, this was after the break-up of Well Pleased & Satisfied, or a side-project, whatever, while in the group still? A: Yeah, the Ball of Fire label it was after the Well Pleased & Satisfied, the guys are not clingin' to... every time I want to do harmony, sometime harmony group. Say for instance, I'm doing 'Black On Black', now one of the guys they have to go and sing the harmony, and I have to leave the lead and come back and give him the stone, and when I give him the stone he's not owning the stone, so I have to come down and sing the harmony. Go back and take up the lead, you understand. So after a while then I carry these guys too far, man. Like I'm beggin' these guys to really come with me, ca' I'm writin' songs, I'm producin' songs. If I was in Europe, say ten to fifteen or twenty years ago, I would be a millionaire. Trust me, ca' the people in Europe they love my songs. The Europeans, I love them, man. They are deep, man. Q: So what was the link-up between you and the Burning Sounds label in London? A: Yeah well, that's what I tell you now, that guy Paul was workin' at the ministry house and I gave him the album and I said look, man... my brother used to have his family in England and he still have his family there but I didn't remember that my brother - because I was not close with my brother to ask him. So I said to Paul, "You're working at the ministry, we're not getting any money. Now look, I know you have to get a lickle small, but this is big. I'm gonna buy this ticket for you, I'm gonna take you to my business weh I have my bag, I take you in the office, sit down. I'm gonna show you the business, what you gonna do", this and that, and tell him everything, right. And I buy his ticket and everything, I pressed up 45s and give him that he sell them when he come on a pre-release system, and we export that along with him. Anyway, I said, "Man, I'm gonna share this thing, fifty-fifty with you. You don't put no money, you don't put nutten. All you gonna put, you gonna take this through the ministry, leave and go to England and do the business for me. Whatever you get, when you come back we gonna start a business together. It gonna be me and you holding up this recording company, OK?" And he write very pretty and he's quick, his script is like a type-machine printing that letter, y'know. So I like that about him.

Q: So which was the first album, 'Love Train' or 'Give Thanks & Praise'? A: I give him the album 'Give Thanks & Praise'. Q: That was the first one, your debut long player? A: Yeah. And I gave him 'Love Train', and he got what you call an advance from mister... Q: Mr Rana, head of Burning Sounds. A: Rana. And he take that money across to New York where he link up with another guy called Paul Houghton who have a record shop in New York in those days called Soul Heaven Record Shop, Soul Heaven. So he claimed that that guy borrowed some of the money and this and that and he hooked up with that guy, and then all kinda t'ing happened. When he come to Jamaica I was gonna hurt him, and then his mother said to me, "Jerry, he is really down". She said, "Man, I've never seen you this way, you don't feel nutten, my son". I'm sorry for that lady, when I look at her, his mother, I said no, I ain't gonna do this. I sorry for the lady and I just walk with him to make a phone call, because he claimed that he lent Paul Houghton in New York who owned the record shop some of the money. How could I send him to England to do my business, and then "take back my money with you, and let us start a business in Jamaica. And you're gonna go to England, take my money back to New York, then you lend it to somebody. Then you come back to Jamaica to tell me that you lent it to somebody - what should I do?" Anyway, I give him a chance, because he called the guy and I say bwoy, y'know, don't worry. One day I met this guy Paul Houghton at Total Sounds, finally meet him, you understan'. I realised it was him, and I said man, you owe me some money. And I tell him how much the guy lent him an' t'ing an' t'ing. So he got a gold chain and a gold ring, he told me he had a thousand dollars in his pocket, so I take away everything that he's got. And there was a big rock behind the studio door, and the man... the devil was tellin' me that I should take the rock and do it, beat him. But there's a God in me that said no, my wife and my kids at home, my wife could never take care of my four kids. So therefore I forget about it, I give him a chance. I don't think that. So now I'm saying that look, y'know... it's like everywhere I turn, man. So I take off what he have, and he say he's gonna go to his record shop office and then pay me. All now I don't see him, maybe his business got flat down. But the money that Paul Houghton had steal from me, he take that money and opened a record shop for himself. And then now some guys from Puerto Rico or some of those guys in America, they go to the roof of the shop and take out all the content, the money, the stuff, everything, they clean him out totally. So I don't know where he is, Jamaica or otherwise. Q: So in other words you never dealt with Mr Rana yourself, I mean after the first album? A: No, no, no. No, I never met him. I tell Paul he must go, and if he got a deal then come back to Jamaica with the money and then we gonna start producing more albums. Then he could take off again, he could do the promotion, and we could share the music. I need someone like him to take care of the work, taking care of the record business, you understan'. Because I'm doing my bag business, I can't... I've gotta go to the country, and sell my thing. I ain't got no time to really do so much t'ing, you understan', so I need help. So I said to him we share the company if he help me. And then all that he couldn't satisfy, he take everything for himself. So you see I had no luck. Q: You just got a name for those albums, no other such benefit. A: Just the name, man. And you see, I'm not a person who's afraid to speak my history, because I know where my history guide me and tells me. 'Cause if I say I'm gonna hurt someone, each one by the test of time would get something, but if God can talk to you and say 'don't do that', if you do that you're gonna go... you understan'. I could revert myself and re-baptise myself and come back into the business and say, look man, I'm gonna be on my own. So you see, anyone who is with me right now with the business, and if they're not listening and try to guide me and I guide them, I'm gonna go follow my line. Because I know I can sing to make a living. And once people dance offa your music, that mean they gotta dance to your music, that mean you can make money. If they don't dance to your music, you can't sell.

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Article: Peter I (Please do not reproduce without permission)