Legendary DJ Dennis Alcapone: “Bring back some user-friendly lyrics” (The Interview)

Dennis, a lot of the world is like that—I think a lot of the world is like that.
I’ll give you a little story about that. When I did that tune, and first came to England on tour I met this guy, and he said to me, “You know that tune that you did, ‘Nanny Version?’” When you said, “When you ain’t got no money, Brother, then you ain’t got no friends?” He said, “I just love [those] lyrics. Because I was there. I’ve been through that. So that part of the lyrics it got hold of me.”

Yeah, it relates—
Yes, it relates a lot so I used to love that song. Just for that part of the song.

Me too, me too.
Millions of people, you know, can relate to that.

Yes. Yes. Now one thing I also want to clarify, Dennis, is one of your famous catchphrases. I listen to it a million times, but sometimes you can’t know until you ask the man who’s responsible. When you say “A-Waso, El Paso?,” –
(Laughing)

—are you saying—first of all, am I saying it right? “A-Waso, El Paso?”
It rhymes.

And is that patois? Does it have a meaning?
Yes, it’s patois. It’s patois.

Is it basically saying, “What’s up, El Paso?” “A-Waso” like “What’s up?”
No—well, it’s kinda illustrating the greatness of the sound.

(Laughing) Now I got it. Now, Dennis, I also really want to ask this: You know, studying the lyrics of your songs—especially the big hits [of] which you have so many—it made me want to ask about, a little bit about your songwriting process. Because, for example, I may have sent you my interview from this summer of [legendary singer] Johnny Osbourne. And Johnny Osbourne told me that when he writes songs—he doesn’t write songs. He said basically all his lyrics are spontaneous, and the riddim is what tells him what to say. And—
Quite right.

What did you say?
(Laughing) That’s right.

Is that how you—
That’s right, especially the bass line.

Wow!
The bass line talks to you.

And so are you saying also, that you’re like—are you like Johnny [Osbourne] then in that your lyrics they [are created] as you’re listening to the riddim? Or do you write them ahead of time?
Well it’s what [they] call “head talk.” You just work off of the top of your head.

Wow.
And you listen. When you listen to the riddim, the riddim is telling you what to say. So Johnny Osbourne is so right. Sometimes you ride off of the bass.

But let me ask you—because your lyrics for all of your hit songs—you have so many hit songs—which are all so, the lyrics are so cool and crisp, they’re so conscious every time. And if you’re doing it spontaneous, is there a time, like when—because you have to keep doing songs, you have to record them. In order to get them the same way, to be the same lyrics every time, is there a point where you write down the lyrics to make sure, you know, that it stays consistent between performances?
No. What really happens, when you play the sound system it’s like a rehearsal. And it’s like a testing place for the songs that you’re doing. When you’re in the dance and deejaying—most of the time, when I was deejaying in the dance, there was a lot of people, because youths would gather around. To watch what I’m doing. They were so enthusiastic about the DJ genre. So anyway, when I’m deejaying sometimes I hear inside of my head that guy is saying something pertaining to what I am saying. And I would hear what he’s saying—soul food. And I link it to what I’m saying. And so on, and so on. But when you’re in the dance and people [are] just enjoying themselves, and they’ve [had] a few drinks, a few spliffs (laughing), right, inspiration just keeps forming. All the while you hear somebody deejaying—not professionally, but they are saying something, you know, [that] you can relate to? So I can draw from that, and mix it in with my lyrics.

But then does there come a point—that makes so much sense, and is actually quite beautiful artistically to think about—what you’re doing there in the sound system. But when you want to translate that to a recording—when you want to take that into the recording studio—is that the point where you have to [commit the lyrics] to paper? Or no?
No, no, no. It’s in your head.

Wow! You already know it. You know it.
I know it. It’s programmed. Most of the time it’s just one take. You don’t write it up. It’s already written in your brain. (Laughing)

Well that is just amazing. Now one of the tunes that you did—before I forget to ask about it—after you recorded for Coxsone for a while, you also recorded for another legendary producer. I think he’s a producer you once named as one of our favorites—if not the favorite. [I’m speaking] of Duke Reid for Treasure Isle.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

He became your steady employer. You were paid weekly I believe by him?
Yes, because I also brought [DJ] Lizzy with me to Treasure Isle. And Lizzy was getting paid as well—weekly.

Why?
There was some bad blood going on there between them. Because they were saying that every song that they wrote with John Holt, John Holt took the song for himself. And it caused a rift with them. So Barry and Tyrone Evans, they got a girl from America named Roslyn Sweat. So they brought her now, because when they brought her down, John wasn’t coming to join the group anymore. They brought Roslyn Sweat with them. So I went down to pick up all three of them up at the airport, and carried them back to Treasure Isle. Take them to their hotel afterward. And then the following day, [I] picked them up and carried them back to the studio, and [they] recorded this song called “Blackbird Singing in the Dead of the Night.” Big song. Big song. And another song I can’t remember the name—the title of it at the moment—you know, but great singers, great guys. And I actually dropped them back [off] at the airport after a week that they spent in Jamaica.

That’s so amazing to think about.
So great. So great. A different direction of the music. A different department, you know? You’ve got to be flexible. Especially when you [work] for Duke Reid. Because Duke Reid always had his gun at his side (laughing).

I can’t even imagine—I saw where you talked in numerous interviews about him walking with guns—and he would have his—I think he was able to hear from where he was in his office what was happening in the studio. And if he wasn’t happy he might fire off a (laughing)—fire off a round.
(Laughing) Yes, yes. He would fire off shots, you know? And get you—

But you still loved—well I don’t know if you “loved” him, but you still liked him?
Yes, yes. (Laughing) I worked for Duke Reid mostly because he put some money in my pocket.

Yeah. He was good about that?
Yes. A lot of [other] producers, apart from Keith Hudson, it’s like they’ve got superglue in their pocket. The money cannot come out. (Laughing)

(Laughing) Now isn’t it true that the first song that I believe that you recorded for Treasure Isle—it wasn’t—you were still recording for Coxsone. And Duke Reid’s engineer, Byron Smith, I believe he had a track called “Barbed Wire” by Nora Dean that he produced. And I believe the story is that he didn’t want Coxsone to know that he was retaining your services. And this was why he put the track out under “El Paso.” And of course I’m talking about—I mentioned it earlier—I love this song, this is the wicked track “Mosquito One” [recorded] [o]ver at Treasure Isle.
Yes, Mr. Smith was the engineer at the time. Byron Smith. So he called me, and I went down. And they told me he’s got this track that he wants me to version. So I said to him, “Really and truly, Mr. Smith, I shouldn’t be recording here, you know, because Coxsone is a ‘funny guy.’”

(Laughing) A “funny guy” meaning he might be upset if he knows?
(Laughing) Yeah, yeah. Because they had a little bit of a run-in with [legendary singer] Alton [Ellis]. Because Alton did leave Treasure Isle and went and worked on most of [his] songs for Studio One. Yeah, so there was a—they had a rift. [And even] before that with the sound system[, too]. So they were always “at it.” So anyway, I was a little bit reluctant, but I still voiced that tune for Byron Smith. So what he did, he didn’t put “Dennis Alcapone” on the [record] label, he put “El Paso.”

And you even shout out “El Paso” in the song?
Yes, El Paso. So he put it—they used to call me “El Paso,” you know, after—that was one of my nick—pet names.

After [your] sound [system]? After the sound [system] you had created it?
Yeah, because of the sound system.

And now, Dennis, I have to ask, we have to talk about these lyrics [of] “Mosquito One.” [We] have to talk about it, because I love them so much. Because the song begins—it’s so original: “Mosquito one, mosquito two, mosquito jump in a hot callaloo.” (Laughing) And I laugh every time I think about this. And every time I hear it. And [so] I have to ask[, because] if you’re not Jamaican sometimes [the] lyrics in some of these great old Jamaican tunes—they can go right over your head. Because sometimes they’re based on folklore. Or on [distinctively] Jamaican things. Or on patois. And so I have to ask you: What is happening in this beautiful, creative, quirky, hilarious song with the mosquito? Why is the mosquito jumping in the callaloo? (Laughing)
All I can say [is] it’s a folk song, you know? We had a great lady in Jamaica called Louise Bennett—

Ms. Lou!
Ms. Lou. So all those folk songs come from Ms. Lou.

That comes from Ms. Lou! Oh my gosh, you know who was telling me about Ms. Lou recently is [legendary singer] Nadine Sutherland. I interviewed Nadine Sutherland, and she—when she was a child—[she] was on the [TV] program that Ms. Lou did. I forget what it was called, but it was the program that she did on television—Ms. Lou.
There was one called “Massran & Ms. Lou.” This was on the radio. There was a special night where that one would come on, and everybody would gather around the radio [to listen] to Ms. Lou.

And then the callaloo—the “Mosquito One” lyrics—the mosquito jumping in the callaloo—that comes from a Ms. Lou song?
Ms. Lou, Ms. Lou, Ms. Lou. Ms. Lou. She was the folk lady at that time in Jamaica, you know? Anytime you want to listen to patois or things like that, she would joke around with it, you know? We grew up listening to her.

Now one thing I’m quite sure that Ms. Lou did not come up with is [the lyrics that] follow in the song of “Mosquito One.” And I just have to ask—make sure I’m hearing it correctly—because it’s so wicked I think. Because later in the song, am I not correct, it says: “Mother lock the door, and father got the key, but baby that won’t stop you from loving me.” (Laughing) Ms. Lou could not have said that!
(Laughing) No, no, no. “Mother lock the door, and father got the key, but baby that won’t stop you from loving me.” When you’re really trying to chill with your girlfriend, you have to come up with those kind of lyrics.

Chukki Starr & Dennis Alcapone (Photo: Teacher)

Oh my gosh, that is so wicked. Now I want to quickly try to ask, Dennis, because you recorded some great songs for Bunny Lee. And I was deprived of a chance—I actually was recalling this last night—because interestingly, I was sending I Kong my interviews of Earl “Chinna” Smith that I did when I was in Jamaica last. Which was in 2020. Before the pandemic struck. And as I was interviewing Chinna, he said “You really have to go interview “my father,” Bunny Lee. And I was shocked because I didn’t know Bunny Lee was still alive even. And I said, “Bunny Lee is alive!?” And he said, “Yeah, he [is still alive and] in London. He’s ‘my father.’ You have to go and interview him.” And then later that same year, Bunny Lee passed.
Okay.

Yeah so I have to ask, because Bunny Lee—I wanted to ask you—because you did so many great songs with him, what is a fond memory or two of Bunny Lee that leaps to mind? And also, what made him such a successful producer?
Well he’s got a lot of things to say with everybody. Because Bunny Lee was actually responsible for the Soul Syndicate band. Yeah because those guys [were] raised in Greenwich Farm—where he was from. And Earl Chinna Smith, Santa Davis—

Tony Chin.
Yes, and Fully Fullwood—

Yeah.
—and all those guys, you know, he took them to the studio. And turned them into great musicians. Because they wanted a break. And Bunny Lee gave them that break. So as they play along to different riddims, they get better and better. Then that Soul Syndicate band becomes a real good band.

Yeah. One of the best I think, yeah.
Yes. And a lot of other producers were using them, so they got [very big] after that.

When you think of him yourself, because you recorded so much with him, what is like a fond memory, or what is it that you think about—like a time you can think about recording with him? Or maybe it wasn’t in the recording studio, but what’s a good time that you remember of being with him?
Not getting paid.

(Laughing) “Not getting paid.”
(Laughing)

That wasn’t what I was expecting you to say, Dennis. (Laughing)
(Laughing) Yeah, yeah, not getting paid. The only thing he would do, he would send somebody up to Kentucky [Fried Chicken]—up [to] Crossroads—and buy a bucket or two of Kentucky [Fried] Chicken. And give food to the artists and the musicians.

Oh my gosh. (Laughing)
Where the money is concerned, Bunny Lee has got superglue in his pockets.

Yeah but you might get some fried chicken. But you might not get any money?
You ain’t getting no money.

Now you have such great songs in your catalog, Dennis, that evidence a Rasta influence. And to name just a few, there’s “Rasta Dub,” “Jah Guide Us,” “Jah Rastafari” (which is alternatively named “Wonderman”). And then also, you have a very wicked song that’s called “Rocking Ethiopia,” which I think that you did for Sir J.J.
Sir J.J., yeah—a version of the Ethiopian “Seelah.”

Can I ask, Dennis, when did you personally become influenced by Rastafari? And were there any musicians or other people who were around you or in your life who were kind of influencing you when you were writing those songs—and singing those songs that show that Rastafarian influence?
Well it was me and my friends. We used to go to the Rasta camp to smoke, and listen to [the Rastas] reasoning. Rasta is the one, you know, who let me know that I must not eat pork. Rasta is the one who taught me to eat good. [To] [s]top smoking [cigarettes]—

Yeah vital—ital, yeah.
Yeah, so I get some good teaching from the Rasta camp. That’s where my influence came from.

And it started to blend into your music?
Yes. Yes. When we go to light the pipe in the Rasta camp, we have to say our prayers. So it was just lovely. It was spiritual. And we gravitated to that, me and my young friends dem. We used to go to the Rasta camp every evening, and we would share a spliff because we weren’t big enough to smoke one spliff [by ourselves]— (laughing)

The whole thing. (Laughing)
Right. Yeah we share spliffs. So some of the guys would just [light] the chalice, you know? When you light the chalice, you gotta say a prayer. So all of that comes from out of the [Rasta] camp [we went to]. And those people used to preach not even love, [but] pure love coming from the Rasta group.

Respect.
So that’s how we gravitate to that side of the world. And so a lot of that comes out in some of my songs.

Yeah. For sure. And those songs are so conscious. And in “Rocking Ethiopia,” you sing “it’s a land of love where I can get a lot more blessings, I say.”
From above. Yeah.

And I love that song—that line—it’s such a cool tune. Since I know you’ve toured all over the world, Dennis, I can’t resist asking, did you ever get a chance to sing “Rocking Ethiopia” in Ethiopia?
No, I haven’t been to Ethiopia, unfortunately. (Chuckling)

Can I tell you—I told Ras Michael, yesterday, I had a conversation with [legendary singer, drummer, and spiritual leader] Ras Michael. And I told him I would be talking to you today. And I told him I would [be] ask[ing] you this question—this very one I just asked you. And I said, “I’m gonna ask, Dennis—Ras Michael, I’m gonna ask Dennis if he’s ever done this “Rocking Ethiopia”—which I love—in Ethiopia.” And Ras Michael said, “Even if Dennis”—and he said I have [his] permission to tell you this [that Ras Michael said:] “If Dennis says that he never [performed ‘Rocking Ethiopia’] in Ethiopia, tell him he is part of Ethiopia anyway.”
Ras Michael [is] a good man. Ras Michael is my brederen. I want you to big him up when you talk to him again.

I will.
Because, you know, I’ve got a brederen in Jamaica in “Fletchers Land.” He speaks to Ras Michael quite regularly. And Ras Michael is sending greetings to me, and I am doing the same thing. Through my brederen—his name is “John Bird.”

Respect. Well I’ll make sure that [Ras Michael] knows—that he hears—he wanted you to know, it doesn’t matter whether you’ve ever been there[, to Ethiopia]—he said “You’re already there.”
Spiritually, spiritually.

Exactly, exactly.
I’ve never really been to Africa, you know?

Wow.
That’s a place that I always wanted to go. But I wasn’t invited there.

Wow.
So it’s a part of the world that is—what do you call it—“virgin ground” to me.

Could it still happen, Dennis? If a producer—if they could bring you to Africa—would you go?
I was invited to Sierra Leone one time. But there was some kind of war kinda thing going on—

Yeah.
So I said, “No, no. I’m not ready for that.”

Yeah, that’s heavy.
Yeah. Africa is a place that you’ve got to get a [bunch] of injections—you have to inoculate yourself.

Yeah, that’s a lot.
[You have to] [m]ake sure you’re up to it.

True. Dennis, I watched an interview that you did with “Muscle” for “2 Lined Music Hut” in which you talked about your relationship, a little bit, with legendary singer Dennis Brown. And you mentioned, for example, how, when you were both working at Studio One, that you would often take Dennis to lunch. And you would buy him a Pepsi. And I think what’s called—I have to ask you this—I think it’s called a “Spirit” bun?
No, what really happened is Dennis Brown came down and see me there. You know, Dennis Brown was a little boy [at that time]. And Dennis Brown had a song with Derrick Harriot called “Lips of Wine”—that was his first song. And when he came to Studio One now, he didn’t have any money, because, you know, as artists, producers don’t give you any money. I had a few shillings at the time, so I would treat him to lunch every day. And our lunch consist[ed] of [a three-pence] bun—“Purity” bun—

A “Purity” Bun!
Yeah “Purity” is the [name of the]—

Bakery.
—the bakery where they cook the bun.

I see.
So (laughing) our lunch was a three-pence Purity bun, three-pence cheese, and a bottle of Pepsi-Cola. Yeah, so me and D-Brown used to be there [with] Alton [Ellis]. And later on “Sleepy”—Horace Andy. So we used to sit out back of Studio One. There were some boards down there that we would go and sit on. And Dennis would borrow Alton’s guitar. Alton would teach him how to play the guitar—

Wow.
—so when Horace Andy would come, Horace would grab the guitar from Dennis as well. So sometimes, Alton would come looking for his guitar and he would say, “Where is that likkle boy!?” (Laughing)

(Laughing) Dennis—Dennis [would] take his guitar?
Right. That was—[yes, ]D. Brown [he] was looking for—an acoustic guitar he had. From there now, I used to take Dennis out like to [Brotherton Avenue,] Kingston 13 on my side. And Dennis used to light his little spliff. So on my corner now there was a little place he could get a little spliff to smoke. So we’d sit down and reason. And smoke. And then we’d go girl hunting. We and The Heptones now, we’d team up and we’d [go] to the drive-in cinema.

Wow. And hangout?
Yeah. So we were enjoying ourselves at that time, you know?

You later—I read this so I wanted to just ask about it. Is it accurate that you later produced some Dennis Brown songs?
Yes, I produced a song called “Once Upon a Time.”

“Once Upon a Time?”
With Dennis Brown—yes.

Okay. Later today [I’ll] go listen to that.
Yes, I produced that song. And I also did a version—the ‘A’ side and the ‘B’ side. Dennis was on the ‘B’ side. That song was called “Get in the Groove.”

Wow. And what record label did that come out on?
Say that again?

What record label did that come out on?
Oh, my label that I had at the time called “Uprising.”

Cool. And I also—just to ask—you produced also tunes for Augustus Pablo as well?
Yes, that song was produced at Randy’s.

What song did you produce for Augustus Pablo?
You know I can’t remember the title of it at this moment in time.

I’ll have to find it, yeah.
It was one of those riddims that I had that he just played something on it. And there’s another story again with Augustus. He came to Studio One while I was there, right? And he was just a likkle shy kid, right? (Laughing) I’m looking at him now walking into Studio One—he came in as an organist.

And skinny, too? Shy and skinny.
Shy and skinny. He came in as a keyboard player, right? I don’t know what went down with him and Sir Dodd, but he didn’t stay there for too long. And then he left and he went to Randy’s. And that’s where he did the song called “Java” [with the Soul Syndicate].

I love that “Java.”
Yeah by blowing the melodica. And he didn’t look back from that, because Augustus is not a keyboard player anymore [after that]. Because “Java” make it—“Java” hit it very big.

Yeah, it was giant.
And so his trade now was—

Melodica.
Blowing that thing, yeah.

Now Dennis I have to ask about this wicked and rare video footage of you on YouTube. It’s footage I sent you a copy of. And you said, “Yeah, this is young Dennis Alcapone.” And it’s footage of you at the Edinburgh festival in 1973. I think this was your first trip to the U.K Is that right?
Correct.

And Dennis, somebody uploaded this footage of you—that I sent you last week—somebody uploaded it to YouTube ten years ago. And since that time, people have watched it—that footage that I sent you—179,000 times people have watched that clip of you. Everyone—everyone who listens to this interview, I hope, will immediately go and watch that footage. And you first sing “Cassius Clay,” and your command on the stage—your performance—is so hot! I don’t think that Edinburgh—they showed a picture of the audience—I’m not sure that they understood—that they knew what hit them. You knocked them out. (Laughing)
(Laughing) Well that was [in] 1973 when I first came to England. I did a tour, and they wanted me on that festival. It was me and Nicky Thomas, The Marvels, [The] Pioneers, and this guy called Winston Groovy. And a few others who were on the bill. But what really happened is—it’s in Scotland. And the BBC2 had a program there [called] “The Old Grey Whistle Test.” And they [were] the one[s] who filmed it. And it was not available to the public for a long, long time. And someone send a raw copy—come and give [it to] me. Yes, and I had it. And then I started to distribute it to my fellow musicians that was on that show, right? But that particular video has been uploaded so many times.

It’s unbelievable. And do you remember—I mean the next—like I said you sing “Cassius Clay.” But then the next song in the footage that people can watch [on YouTube] is called “Wake Up, Jamaica”—a[nother] great song. It’s so nice to watch. And I know it’s a bit silly, Dennis, but when you’re watching that, in the last minute of the footage, you’re doing your thing on the stage, and it’s a beauty to see. But suddenly the camera [pans], and you can see your shoes.
(Laughing)

(Laughing) And I was amazed, Dennis! Because you have—there’s like 5-inch heels! You have these giant heels! What is going on? (Laughing)
That was the thing at the time—they were called “platform” shoes. (Laughing)

(Laughing) And then you had to—I was amazed, because I was [thinking] how is he able to move so good—[looking] so practiced in those shoes.
(Laughing) Yeah, like I said, a lot of people upload it on my Facebook [page]. So many times it’s unbelievable. You know I was saying to myself, “These people don’t see that it’s been uploaded so many times on the same page.” But, you know, people just love that 1973 performance.

And it’s thereafter that you moved to the U.K., permanently. And I have to ask about that Jamaica Showcase. Because I believe among other stars it included yourself, Toots & The Maytals, Cynthia Richards, Al Brown, a young Sly Dunbar, and also, a young Dennis Brown.
Quite right.

And this is such an amazing array of talent—it’s mind-blowing when you think about, and you read that Sly Dunbar [and] all these people were on there. But I did want to ask, Dennis, because Sly Dunbar was there with [the band] “Skin, Flesh & Bones”—and I was surprised because I have interviewed Carl Malcolm. And I was wondering—I was like, “Wow, I wonder why Carl Malcolm wasn’t on the tour?” But then I noticed that maybe it was because “No Jestering”—“No Jestering” was one of the big Carl Malcolm [hits]. It came out in ’73. But then his other songs, the big hits “Miss Wire Waist” and “Fatty Boom-Boom,” they came out later. I was just curious because he was, I think, the main singer for “Skin, Flesh & Bones” at that “Tit for Tat” Club, and—
No, the main singer [for “Skin, Flesh & Bones”] was Al Brown.

Al Brown?
Yeah that’s the main singer [for that band]. And he had a big hit with the outbreak song called “Here I Am Baby.”

I see. So he—
He and Cynthia Richards, they were the resident singers at Tit for Tat.

And Carl Malcolm just wasn’t that big at that time yet?
I only heard about Carl Malcolm when I came to England. I didn’t know of him in Jamaica.

That makes sense then why he wasn’t on that showcase. Because—
No, no, no. Because like I say, Carl Malcolm made his name while I was in England.

I see.
Yeah, so [at] that time, 1974, Carl Malcolm wasn’t around the music scene—not that anyone would recognize anyway.

I see. Now did all those stars that came from Jamaica on that showcase, yourself included, did you guys all travel together on the same plane? And were you in the same hotel? And if you were, what stands out as, you know—what stands out as a memory about traveling and staying in the same hotel with these stars?
Well we weren’t actually in a hotel. The promoter had booked a house.

Oh, okay, you were in a house together?
Yeah, all of us were in this big house—big, big.

What was that like to be in a big house with Sly and Dennis Brown—
(Laughing)

—and Toots?
Well to be honest with you, it—we didn’t take it as nothing at that time. Because we already knew each other, if you understand? I didn’t know Sly much, but I saw him playing at [the] Tit for Tat Club. And he was playing with Ranchie [McLean]—and Lloyd Parks was the bass player at that time. There was, I think, there were about two other musicians who I can’t remember at this time. But they [were] called “Skin, Flesh & Bones.” So we all traveled up for that showcase. And that was the time when this promoter called Admiral Ken in London—he was a promoter at the time. And he took me and Dennis Brown from the showcase and put us with Desmond Dekker—to do a show at the Empire Ballroom. And that’s when Bob Marley came that night to see the show. So it was Bob Marley, Family Man, and Carly.

Wow!
[They] came to the show and there was a popular English boxer there at the time, too, named something or other—[Bunny] Sterling—I can’t remember—they all came to the show together, and I actually—Bob was backstage with us. So I called him onto the stage and introduced him to the crowd. And the rest is history. At that time, he was just promoting the “Catch A Fire” album.

Did—did—this is so amazing to me. Did you know Bob Marley before that night? Were you already acquainted with him from being in Jamaica?
Yeah man. Yeah man. (Laughing) We was rolling together in some form or way. Because I can remember one day, me and Lizzy walked into Randy’s Records Shop. And he was in the record shop. And he was actually leaning up on the counter. And when me and Lizzy walk in, he passed some remarks to say, “All uno little boys work for Studio One. Coxsone, you know.” (Laughing) So I said to Lizzy, “Did you hear what Bob say?” And Lizzy say, “Yeah man, mi hear him.” You know so we walked past Bob and go towards the LP records rack—it was a further step up when you go into the store. And me and Lizzy was reasoning. So anyway, we step [out] and we were walking outside, and Bob remarked to us, “[Al Capone, a nu the I me a-talk,] you know? But the I dem no fe work for Coxsone, you know? Coxsone a thief!” So I said to him, “Bob, listen, I’m a deejay, right? So I have to find where the good riddims are to work on. U-Roy is at Treasure Isle, right? And next to Treasure Isle, Studio One have the good riddims. So that’s my job, I have to find good riddims to work on.”

And what did Bob say?
He was alright after that. He was cool. When I explained [it] to him. But he had some grievances [with] Coxsone. And I understood totally [what his concerns were]. He was just up the road, you know? We’d see Bob every day. And sometimes he would come down to Idlers’ rest, very rarely, but he would come down there because his record shop was [on] Charles Street. And Bunny Lee’s shop was on Orange Street. Charles Street is just a couple steps up the road. We would see Bob regular[ly]. [And] the guy that was working in Bob’s record shop was my friend. A guy we called “Johnny Cool.” [Some people would call him “Johnny Lover.”] He was the one that was selling [records] in Bob’s shop.

And so Bob—it sounds like he always had a good relationship with the musicians. That people he respected, he always had a good relationship with them. From what I can tell. It was never a rivalry or anything like that.
No, no, there is no rivalry. There is just music. Beautiful stuff, you know? He just wanted to get good production. Because, you know, Studio One [had the good riddims]. He started the Tuff Gong label with “Skill” Cole. And Bunny and Peter. And then they had the relationship with Scratch—Lee Perry. They started recording for Lee Perry. Yes, it’s a lot of lovely history.

It is. And Dennis—I want to—it’s such beautiful history. We’ve been talking now for about, almost, unbelievably, because the time goes fast, over an hour now. Actually closer to 70 minutes. And I want to thank you for being so generous with your time. And also with these memories. These really precious memories that you have. And at a time like this, I always—when I’m speaking to a giant legend like yourself—a legend in the music—I always start to feel a little bit inept. Because I start to think about all the things I wish I could have asked you about. And the things that I still want to ask you about. And all your many songs. Because you have so many that I love. And I’m hoping, Dennis—this is just a pitch and a plea to you that we can stay in touch. And I’m hoping that, maybe sometime—maybe even next year sometime—we could maybe talk again. And I can ask you some more questions about more of your historic songs. Would you be up for that maybe?
Yes, maybe we can do a part 2.

Yeah, I would love it. Even Angus—I would point out, my esteemed colleague Angus Taylor, who I have a lot of respect for, when he interviewed you, he had two parts too. Because even he couldn’t do it [all in] one part. (Laughing)
No, no, no. You need a whole week.

Exactly! You need like a whole class at a museum—a reggae university. Now Dennis, until we can hopefully connect again for the sake of the history—reggae history—I only have two more questions—two more to ask today. And the first one is: Are you recording new music still, and what musical projects, tours, other musical endeavors are in store for Dennis Alcapone—that all music lovers should watch out for? Both [until] the end of this year, [and] going into next year?
Well, I’m working on an album for myself at the moment.

Nice!
With some original tracks from way back when.

Wow. Cool.
I want to keep the thing real, if you understand?

Yeah.
And from time to time, I’ve been recording for other people. In Europe. In America. And some other places, you know, where there are still records to be released.

Awesome.
Unreleased records, you know? So I’ve never stopped working, really. And I still—I’ve got records on tape now that still haven’t “reached the road” as yet. A lot of projects that I’m working on that should be coming out next year sometime.

Well I know all the people are going to be thrilled. I’m thrilled to hear that Dennis Alcapone has just said that he’s going to release a [new] full-length album—
Correct.

—coming some time in the future.
Yes, I actually did compile one from Treasure Isle to Studio One.

Nice.
A compilation that I personally compiled myself.

Beautiful.
Hasn’t hit the road as [of] yet.

Beautiful. Beautiful. Now I want to say, you know, Dennis, I hope that God/Jah guide and protect you always. You’re one of the treasured heroes of this music. And, you know, so many people, including myself, have gotten so much joy out of listening to your songs—for so long. So we just treasure you. And we want to keep you safe. And keep you around a long, long time. My final question, Dennis, before we hang up—and we’ll be in touch because I will want to talk to you before I publish the transcript of this interview. Because you said some things—some names of people, places, and things—that I will want to make sure for historical purposes are accurate. So I’ll be sure to get in touch with you about that later. But, Dennis, before we hang up for today—and I give you a rest—what final message would you like to send out to all the many, many Dennis Alcapone fans in Jamaica, in the United States, in the U.K., in Africa—all over the world—so many people love Dennis Alcapone. What message do you have for us?
My main message is to bring back the love. The love that we used to share. In the early days. Love of the music. Love of each other. And stop the violence in the world. It makes no sense. Because if you deal with violence, you go down in silence.

Oh, wow. Yeah, that’s true. (Laughing)
(Laughing) Right. So I’m just saying, please, bring back the love. Let’s enjoy like we used to do. Let’s go into the dance without thinking that someone is going to shoot up the dance.

So well said.
Let’s go to the dance and have a drink or whatever thing you do—if it’s a spliff you smoke or whatever—[and] enjoy yourself. And go back to your home.

Peaceful.
Yeah, because we lose too [many] people unnecessarily. So, please, let’s bring back the love. Like it used to be. And the lyrics of the music nowadays, you have to take your time with it. Because when the lyrics [are] good and clean, people live in more love. But if you’re gonna bring lyrics that [are] talking about guns, and all kinds of foolishness, then you’re inciting violence. So, please, bring back the love. Bring back some user-friendly lyrics.

They need to be “ a defender, not offenders.” Be a defender, right?
(Laughing) Yes. (Toasting) “Don’t let the children cry, or you’ll have to tell Al Capone why.”

Exactly. Hey Dennis, thank you so much my friend! We’ll be in touch, and you have a great rest of the day, my Brother. Thank you so much, Dennis.
Give thanks, Steve. It’s a blessing.

Bye, Dennis. Thank you, Dennis. Bless up. Talk to you soon.
Respect.

Respect.